Testing Results Junior Hydro 1/2" Tuck
  • We are just getting back from testing in Florida. Sorry, I'm not giving you our speed results, BUT we did spend about 6 hours trying to get the J Hydro on plane. We literally didn't get it on plane until the end of the day. Both Rylan (not an inexperienced driver) and I were extremely frustrated.

    Between moving the transome around , changing the kick bracket many times, and checking height and tuck it was just difficult to figure out.

    I urge the J Committee to reconsider this needless tuck rule. (It is masquerading as a safety issue with no safety issue data to support it). It's going to be a long season for J Hydro drivers and the rest of you painfully watching.

    PS. The J Runabout went on plane first try and every time. No tuck rule on JR.


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • 35 Comments sorted by
  • Not many newcomers will spend this time figuring it out, nor have the understanding what to do when it does't get on plane. We can't just say "tuck it under" anymore...


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • Richard..........Stiwill is advertising his last years boat for sale. It will plane off as a J Hydro in 50 feet every time at 1/2" Tuck. Just a thought to help out. Call him!

    Matt :)


    APBA Member #: 71441
    Boat #: 66-E
    Classes: Stock Outboard
    Region 4
  • Ha. So we all have to buy Stillwell boats now?!? That's not the point. The rule shouldn't favor one boat over another (as you suggest it does, Matt)


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • We had our Sammamish Slough exhibition today. We had 3 J Hydros, including a rookie driver show up and ALL managed to plane off in near whitecap conditions. It did not seem to be a problem for them.

    R-19


    APBA Member #: 6635
    Boat #: R-19, 19-R
    Classes: 20SSH, BSH, CSR, 25SSR
    Region 10
  • its simple Richard............you have a specialized boat built to run the extreme tuck, those who have "normal" boats have no problem getting on plane with the tuck rule.........and as Pat just said we had a race today in whitecaps and the J's had no problem planing in those conditions....

    ITS YOUR BOAT, not the tuck rule!!


    APBA Member #: 1397
    Boat #: 63R
    Classes: 500ccmh/750ccmh/DSH/850ccmh
    Region 10
  • @Pat. That's great. Glad there were no problems. I'm sure the cold water and weather helped with power. I wish we raced in those conditions in the Midwest.


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • @mercguy. You have bad information. Our boats are copies of a Hemp boat on the running surface and was never built for the extreme tuck. We only ended up there when we struggled to get on plane as Grant gained weight. I should also note we picked up speed at 3/8" tuck over the 1" tuck. It's just difficult to get on plane.

    I've made my peace and point. Now we wait and watch... If the Js don't struggle to get on plane this summer I'll gladly buy a round of beers for all at the Nationals.


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • Warm weather did not seem to be a problem for 21 new drivers in Qatar just two weeks ago, most of which had a very limited understanding of English language. JW Myers and Matt Yarno, who are both members of the APBA J committee, put all these new drivers on the water and not a single one had a problem planing in rough water, in high heat. 3 of these boats were Hemps, btw.

    R-19


    APBA Member #: 6635
    Boat #: R-19, 19-R
    Classes: 20SSH, BSH, CSR, 25SSR
    Region 10
  • Cool. Never tested or raced in Qatar. All I know is what we've tested and raced the last 7 years in J mostly in the Midwest. Maybe you are right and nobody will have issues but us. Only time will tell. Looking forward to that beer with you in that case! I am glad to have the extra speed anyways.


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • Ha. So we all have to buy Stillwell boats now?!?




    Cool. Never tested or raced in Qatar. All I know is what we've tested and raced the last 7 years in J mostly in the Midwest. Maybe you are right and nobody will have issues but us. Only time will tell. Looking forward to that beer with you in that case! I am glad to have the extra speed anyways.



    Richard..........just talked to George. He will throw in a free engine re-build if you buy the boat. :)


    APBA Member #: 71441
    Boat #: 66-E
    Classes: Stock Outboard
    Region 4
  • Matt. I don't think you read my other post. I already have a Hemp copy!!! :-)


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • Matt. I don't think you read my other post. I already have a Hemp copy!!! :-)



    Hum........but you don't have a Captain America paint job like George's hydro. That could be the problem!  All kidding aside, when new rules are made we all just have to adjust and look for a new 'grey area' to operate in. You been around long enough to know the game.

    We are heading off testing tomorrow at a nuclear power plant cooling lake here in Virginia......the radioactive water is good for 2mph plus your hair turns green within an hour! Hope we can plane off them Sidewinders!!


    APBA Member #: 71441
    Boat #: 66-E
    Classes: Stock Outboard
    Region 4
  • I do know the game. I also have the experience and financial wherewithal to play it. But, I happen to believe in the J class and it's ability to help revive APBA (it's why I bought and donated (along with Craig Dewald) the 24 J championship props). It's the rules that don't help and happen to hurt I'm calling out in support of the J classes. Again. Maybe I'm wrong.

    Good luck with testing. Let us know what you figure out!


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • Just for kicks, I checked the weather in Qatar.  This week it's in the Mid-80s to low 90's.  So, warm. About the same as in Florida.  The difference:  Qatar: 14% humidity (read: more power).  Florida: 84% (read: less power).  In the Midwest, we also get a third disadvantage for power (in addition to heat and humidity).  Higher altitude. 

    I also wonder if the setup in Qatar was right at 1 3/8" below the bottom and right at 1/2" tuck?  I know if I were running 21 rookies through a J test session, I wouldn't pay attention to these things and would set it up so it would get on plane no matter what (more tuck).

    Not trying to perpetuate this thread -- was just sharing what I looked into. 


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • Richard, 

    I was trying to stay out of this tread but I thought I would add a few things to provide clarification. 

    Qatar Test Sessions -
    • Humidity - I don't have the actually humidity data from our testing when we were there on February 20th & 21st for the first trip and March 21st and 22nd for the second trip.  I do believe it was higher then 14% but I am not sure.
    • Engine Height - Yes, all the engine were set up at 1 3/4" below the bottom of the boat.
    • Tuck - Yes, we were within the 1/2" tuck on all boats.
    • Speed - I am not available to provide that data.  
    • Since we were over in Qatar training these kids for the UIM World Championships in Moses Lake we were following the APBA J Class Rules.   It would have been a complete waste of time if we were not following the rules that they would be racing with in August.   

    Sammamish Slough Exhibition;
    • I can verify that all 3 boats were also at 1 3/4" and within the 1/2" tuck as well.   

    Like I mentioned above even with the 21 rookies we were still within the J Class Rules and had zero trouble getting any kid on plane over 4 complete days.    I hope that this information is helpful.   

    Matt Yarno


    APBA Member #: 9942
    Boat #:
    Classes: J / 125cch
    Region 10
  • Cool.  Thanks, Matt!  Hypothesis are out.  I'm still betting that there will be issues in the Midwest getting on plane.  Now we'll just wait and see how it plays out this Summer.  Thanks for piping in.  Richard


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • I thought J height was 1-3/4" not 1-3/8" was this changed this year???


    APBA Member #: 113
    Boat #: 4-F, 4
    Classes: CSR
    Region 5
  • Typo on my part (and I suspect Matt's). Meant 1 3/4". Too many to keep straight anymore...


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • Thanks Richard, just making sure I didn't miss something. See you in jesup.


    APBA Member #: 113
    Boat #: 4-F, 4
    Classes: CSR
    Region 5
  • I fixed my typo above :)    

    Matt


    APBA Member #: 9942
    Boat #:
    Classes: J / 125cch
    Region 10
  • Cool. Never tested or raced in Qatar. All I know is what we've tested and raced the last 7 years in J mostly in the Midwest. Maybe you are right and nobody will have issues but us. Only time will tell. Looking forward to that beer with you in that case! I am glad to have the extra speed anyways.


    Good thing there's a beer garden in the pits at Moses Lake! Thanks to Ten Pin Brewing Co.! :)


    Also good thing Moses Lake is mostly dry heat in the summer. :)



    APBA Member #: 963
    Boat #: 20R
    Classes: CSR, CSH, 20SSH, 25ssr
    Region 10
  • I do know the game. I also have the experience and financial wherewithal to play it. But, I happen to believe in the J class and it's ability to help revive APBA (it's why I bought and donated (along with Craig Dewald) the 24 J championship props). It's the rules that don't help and happen to hurt I'm calling out in support of the J classes. Again. Maybe I'm wrong.

    Good luck with testing. Let us know what you figure out!



    Richard.........testing went great. We were all 'glowing' after the long day at Lake Anna nuclear power plant test day. Both the Sidewinder ASH's ran like clockwork and both engines ran identical speeds. And best of all they planed off at 1/2 inch tuck. :)


    APBA Member #: 71441
    Boat #: 66-E
    Classes: Stock Outboard
    Region 4
  • What prop works best?


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • ..............We used Abby's Bennett boat and we hit on a 30 year old ASH prop that was laying around in Gary's. shop. Go figure. Lol.

    But it is cool how the various 15ci Sidewinders we have all tested and raced (5 of them i believe) seem to be basically identical in speed.....


    APBA Member #: 71441
    Boat #: 66-E
    Classes: Stock Outboard
    Region 4
  • How fast?


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • ...........Richard, that is a no win question. I would be called a liar either way i answer this. But the speeds are in the ballpark with a 'top shelf' OMC. :)

    Good news is the engines started first pull everytime and ran well throughout the entire powerband.....we never did anything but add gas all day to the engines.

    I will say that although a TOP SHELF OMC and Sidewinder A engine run about the same top end, the Sidewinder will always out accelerate it hence 'Parity' is a farce.


    APBA Member #: 71441
    Boat #: 66-E
    Classes: Stock Outboard
    Region 4
  • Richard,
    Since I believe we are running a copy of the copy of the hemp, can you confirm that for me?  We still have ice up here in the north, and well won't get to testing till May by the looks of things.  What was the setup that you used to get the boat on plane?
    Thanks
    MD



    APBA Member #: 13530
    Boat #: 226M
    Classes: 20 SSH, 302SSH
    Region 6
  • Mike, You will have to move the transom around (forward and backwards) until you find the best spot for the weight of your driver and the weather.  It will change as both driver weight changes and the weather changes.  Don't forget to make sure you stay within the 1 3/4" minimum height and 1/2" maximum tuck restriction as you do it.  I wish I had a better answer for you...


    APBA Member #: 6342
    Boat #: 12H
    Classes: BSR, AMR
    Region 6
  • I'm happy to report that their were no issues with any JH planing in Jessup this past weekend. Weather was clear skies and 80 degrees.

    AA


    Boat #: No
    Classes: No
  • Good to hear!

    How many boats? All running Mercs?

    Mike


    APBA Member #: 9071
    Boat #: 225- V
    Classes: 20ssH, CSH, OSY400
    Region 7
  • We raced JH this weekend at Lawrence Lake and had a total of 6 boats.    No planning issues either day.  

    Two boats where in the water for the very first time which were built in the J SOA  / HARM Project.     

    The weather was everything you could imagine except for 80 degrees we had rain, wind, sun, hail, wind, rain, sun and then it repeated.  

    Matt


    APBA Member #: 9942
    Boat #:
    Classes: J / 125cch
    Region 10
  • No issues with planing at Tabor City for any of the J classes.


    AA


    Boat #: No
    Classes: No
  • Region 10 had another race yesterday at Silver Lake.   We had 8 or 9 boats and no issues getting on plane.

    It was the first race for Ryder Robitoy and he got his first win!   


    APBA Member #: 9942
    Boat #:
    Classes: J / 125cch
    Region 10
  • Some boats had issues planing @NAC in Hinton., WV.


    APBA Member #: 9071
    Boat #: 225- V
    Classes: 20ssH, CSH, OSY400
    Region 7
  • I'd have to ask the kids which ones struggled, but at this point its probably not worth discussing any more.


    APBA Member #: 9071
    Boat #: 225- V
    Classes: 20ssH, CSH, OSY400
    Region 7